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Talk:Turn undead
Destruction power It should be added that the destruction domain doesn't automatically give constructs damage. Instead, you have to imagine the constructs as undead, and if the cleric could have turned the undead (constructs) it would damage them. If the cleric is of so low level that he/she couldn't turn them, the constructs will not be harmed either. A sidenote question; Shelgarns Persistant Blade and Black Blade of Disaster are both classified as constructs, will they be destroyed by a successful turning from a cleric with the destruction domain? -- 27 December 2006 *Constructs are never directly killed by turn undead, even if their HD is less than half the caster level. Instead they will receive magical damage, which BBoD is immune to. WhiZard 19:37, 2 May 2009 (UTC) Duration discrepancy Kudos to TK for adding the duration information to this article. The associated Turned article has the duration set at static 10 rounds (apparently independent of turner's level). It appears in conflict with this article unless there is some additional dynamic to the effect that I cannot uncover. In any event, it appears that Turning-induced Fear is significantly more powerful than any other Fear sources in that it allows no Will save and with no spell resistance unless emulating an outsider. True? --Iconclast 04:35, July 24, 2010 (UTC) * The turned article should not have any mention of duration, as the turned effect can be applied for however long a scripter wants it to be applied. (The duration is part of the turn undead ability, not the turned effect.) But it looks like the discrepancy comes from a deeper problem that needs to be resolved. The turned article is apparently based on D&D, instead of on NWN. I'll go fix that. : : As for being more powerful than fear, you need to be a bit more clear in what you are comparing. Turning does not induce fear; they are separate effects that just happen to have very similar results. The turned effect is more potent than the fear effect in that the usual immunities to fear do not work against being turned, but neither effect has any intrinsic saving throw or spell resistance. The turn undead ability is more potent than the fear spell (for example) in the sense that the spell allows a saving throw, yes. That is part of the price undead must pay to balance out their various immunities. --The Krit 13:52, July 24, 2010 (UTC) :* I think you pretty much cleared things up, TK. The comparison I was considering was an arcane spell (like Fear, Confusion, Blindness, etc.) attempting to neutralize an undead attack threat vs. the potential for turning to do the same. I thought that they (fear-type spells, auras, feats) both used the same effect but really merely share a similar (or identical) frightened animation. The fact that turning is a designed game-balancing mechanism vs. undead didn't occur to me until the respective effects were explained better. :: Just to mention what prompted this interest (albeit off-topic): the Risen Lord shifter form that appears to have no protection against a high-level cleric's turn ability. There is no inherent Turn Resistance granted with the form so it gets turned very easily. Sometimes death, but more often the random wandering effect that essentially becomes fatal under normal circumstances (the duration seemed even longer than just rounds per level but now I know better, eh?). I've read/heard mentioned that there are items that may grant some Turn Resistance but there are no spells or feats that will provide support. Anyway, I understand the difference(s) better now, thanks to your expose'. --Iconclast 19:15, July 24, 2010 (UTC) ::* Going up against a cleric in Risen Lord form is foolish, to say the least. Shifters are based upon versatility, so change forms! ;) Anyway, player characters cannot have turn resistance, even if you find an item that claims otherwise — see the turn resistance article. (Even the turn resistance given to the spectre form of undead shape does not apply to player characters.) The only defenses a player character can have against turning are gaining character levels (higher than cleric level is good), gaining spell resistance (if polymorphed into an outsider), and not polymorphing into a turnable race. One of those is a lot easier than the other two. :) --The Krit 01:16, August 7, 2010 (UTC) :::* A non-intentional confrontation, I assure you, TK. A mob of sprinting duergar warriors with 2 or 3 hidden clerics scattered throughout and coming out of Greater Sanctuary just to turn everything in sight. Consequently, I am much more tentative with that form today, wading through slowly, hoping no true-seers spot my movement until I have sized up the full armada. IIRC the RL in question probably only had 12-14 shifter levels... easy turn bait. In retrospect, should have shifted to whipmaster (rak wisdom prereq was impossible until the game was all but over unfortunately). Thanks, TK. --Iconclast 04:52, August 9, 2010 (UTC) ::::* Shifter level by itself does not affect the ease of being turned. It's total character level that matters. Still, it looks like you picked up some good strategies from that encounter. --The Krit 16:45, August 28, 2010 (UTC) Range At what range does the Turn Undead power work? -- 13:11, 30 November 2011 *The article already states: The affected area has a radius of 20 meters, centered on the turner. :WhiZard 19:01, November 30, 2011 (UTC) Attack of Opportunity? I suspect this has been addressed in the AoO article but I'd like confirmation since I am not certain whether the game treats a Turn Attempt as spell casting or not. My guess is "no". Can the vanilla Turn Undead attempt cause an AoO? TIA --Iconclast (talk) 17:56, November 24, 2012 (UTC), * Nope, turn undead is treated like barbarian rage, does not trigger AoO, dost not use concentration. 19:38, November 24, 2012 (UTC) "Curing" a turned creature Since it is of possible interest to PCs with one of the turnable races (for example, through shifting or other polymorph), I added a note mentioning that clarity (etc.) and restoration (etc.) will not "cure" a turned creature, but dispelling can be effective. - MrZork (talk) 08:37, July 16, 2015 (UTC) *BTW, I was somewhat surprised that dispelling removed the turning (I tested with Mord's), since I thought the script applied it as a supernatural effect. - MrZork (talk) 08:50, July 16, 2015 (UTC) Outsider bonus Isn't "The spell-resistance-based turn resistance stacks with any normal turn resistance the outsider may have." implied by calling this a "bonus" in the preceding sentence? (I.e. the preceding sentence states "Outsiders get a bonus to their turn resistance equal to" rather than "Outsiders get turn resistance equal to".) --The Krit (talk) 22:36, January 27, 2018 (UTC) * Maybe, but the turn resistance itself is just a bonus to creature HD and there are often questions about which bonuses stack. It's something of an unusual case where an NPC outsider has both spell resistance and turn resistance (though I have run across some). I came across the question in-game when discussing what happens when a shifter has both. I knew that PC turn resistance is broken, but I wasn't sure what the result was if an NPC had both, so I checked the script to confirm. - MrZork (talk) 23:19, January 28, 2018 (UTC) :* OK, so same thing but I'll change the clarification. The preceding sentence states "Outsiders get a bonus to their turn resistance equal to" rather than "Outsiders get a bonus to their hit dice equal to". How could a bonus not stack with the thing it's a bonus to? --The Krit (talk) 03:11, January 29, 2018 (UTC) Level of Turning The Turn Undead Page uses the phrase "Character's Level" in describing what level of creatures get turned. This makes it sound like it uses character level, but it seems more likely that it uses cleric level. 17:10, July 19, 2019 (UTC) * See the fourth note in the article. (I suppose it could be moved up to be the first note, if people think the level is more important than the results.) --The Krit (talk) 23:32, July 19, 2019 (UTC)